Help talk:Extension:Translate/Page translation example

This way of translating content makes the page output extremely verbose see for example https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Extension:Math&action=edit It's hard to read and to edit and it reduces the entropy significantly. This reverts the effort of the visual editor to keep the source readable. I think in principal there is no need to store all the translate tags and XML comments in the wikitext. Or is the general strategy to use the visual editor exclusively for editing? In that case I'd vote for making the new wikitext identical to docx, so that it can be edited with Microsoft Word if everything else crashes;-) --Physikerwelt (talk) 18:15, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

This comment is not related to the tutorial at all, is it? It seems a comment about Translate syntax.

Your point seems to be that the Translate marking should be possible in VisualEditor: that's bugzilla:53974, which is blocked on bugzilla:48891. --Nemo 18:25, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

"This page contains changes which are not marked for translation."

Hello. In the tutorial, it is written that

After saving the page, you will see a link at the top of the page saying "Mark this page for translation" (or "This page contains changes which are not marked for translation." if you are not a translation administrator). Click on that link.

I guess that the sentence "Click on that link" refers to the link "Mark this page for translation"? I tried to click on the two links included in the sentence "This page contains changes which are not marked for translation." and none of them lead me to the page shown in the picture. Best, Wikini (talk) 08:08, 9 June 2015 (UTC)

As step 1 says, the tutorial assumes you have rights configured. If you need to mark pages for translation, you need the pagetranslation permission (on this wiki, it's the "Translation administrators" group). --Nemo 14:49, 9 June 2015 (UTC)

Ok, thank you, I didn't got it. I guess this is included in the word "configured" of the first sentence (namely "This tutorial assumes that the Translate extension is already installed and configured")? My following question is: where to apply to be in the "Translation administrators" group? Best, Wikini (talk) 12:26, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Yeah sorry, the beginning could be clearer; the expected audience is only specified in incoming links but not on the page itself, it seems. Will see if I can fix. For what wiki do you want translationadmin flag? On this wiki it's handled at Project:Requests, on other wikis ask the bureaucrats. --Nemo 14:34, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Thanks! Wikini (talk) 15:18, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

How to edit a page with translation units on it

Please define what, precisely, a translation unit is. Supposedly we can rearrange and edit every single character around there delimiters whatever they are. "Translate tags" have the opening and closing tag, but what is this "translation unit" thing? It is is not clear. Is it to the left or the right of the marker? How does a translation unit relate to a translate tag, if at all? Like the description of tables and sections, it has always been true that an editor needs to know how to treat every single character of the wikitext.

What about tables? What about sections? And what about other markup? These things can be previewed, and corrected. Please tell me how to interpret the error page I get when I ruin that environment so badly I can't save my edits.

And please, there's no link from the effectively de-wikified, elite-priveleged only, pages to the help documentation for how to edit them. Cpiral (talk) 02:06, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

The glossary explains what a translation unit is. The reference manual goes into detail on how translation units are identified and more.

Generally, nothing goes bad if the translation administrator marked the page reasonably: you shouldn't bother to touch the tags. Can you link the page you were editing and tell what you were trying to do?

As for the help links, it would be the first extension adding custom help for itself on action=edit; please file the feature request for broader consideration. --Nemo 05:56, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

At Help:Search it's giving me "unbalanced translate tag" and showing me the entire page. But I'm only working on the insource: section. I believe the translations administrator should remove translations from that page until it is stable. For example, currently I'm trying to remove a bug that was documented as a feature. But the reason Help:Search is unstable is not only because of that syntax (task T111293), but also because of the operators that are being added. And CirrusSearch is in beta, and the Search documentation is nowhere to be found, and it needs lots of work. Currently there are 130 translations units getting in the way. So either document how to edit pages with translations on them, and leave out the cruft of administration (I've read some of your links, and learned a few things, but TO NO AVAIL), or reduce the number of units, or remove translations temporarily. Thanks. Cpiral (talk) 06:40, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

There is no "insource" at Help:Search: I don't understand what you are talking about. The report you linked suggests you might be talking of Help:CirrusSearch. Please paste the text you are trying to save and I'll tell you what's the issue. --Nemo 06:57, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

I changed the formerly-off redirect Help:search to Help:cirrussearch, where it belongs per Special:version. Cpiral (talk) 01:45, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

I did the paste-bin. Where will you answer? Cpiral (talk) 06:29, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

@Nemo bis: http://p.defau.lt/?rssqpVbLN8HejTu_r7DZ0w Cpiral (talk) 05:32, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

@Nemo bis: http://p.defau.lt/?rssqpVbLN8HejTu_r7DZ0w Yes. It's Help:CirrusSearch.

@Nemo bis: http://p.defau.lt/?rssqpVbLN8HejTu_r7DZ0w Glad to see you're back contributing today. Please follow up with your offer to help me troubleshoot this translations problem that has blocked my edit for seven days now. Thanks.

@Nemo bis: Would someone please help me? I'm unable to make this edit (at paste-bin per Nemo's request) to the page Help:CirrusSearch because of translations. Thanks.

Nevermind Nemo. Hopefully, we'll help each other later.

Today CirrusSearch patch task T111293 hit the WP and MW sites, so I had to hack away at Help:CirrusSearch to "install" documentation corresponding to that patch. I did find the original "imbalanced translation tag" problem in the section I was not editing. I'd love see a decent how-to help page written for editors. This page and the others are for translators, not editors. All the sudden the wiki that anyone could edit was not editable, and the vacuous lacking was translated the world over. Cpiral (talk) 21:23, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

qqq

I saw the video and now I wonder, what is it that the qqq actually do? It is somehow related to documentation, other translators and review , but how? (probably covered somewhere else, but the video emphasise on that this is important.) AssetDenmark (talk) 15:29, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

Hello AssetDenmark

qqq displays a documentation message so that people can know what is the context or something else.

To access qqq, you can do the following:

• set "Message Documentation" (or qqq) as the default language when you are in the translate extension
• when translating, check the "Add documentation" link. You can there edit the documentation for the translation block you're editing.

Hope this helps, Trizek (WMF) (talk) 10:30, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

Thanks Trizek (WMF) - and sorry I'm a bit frustrated at this moment. I saw the qqq in the setup, and I wondred what it did. (Why not just have a comment button/icon, and hide the thing in the language selector?)

I do have a few challanges with this.. and I may need to ask you for some advice. I wonder if this talk-page is the best palace for that, or should it go more general. (this goes back to this, i finally got to doing this translate a lot of 'en' pages to 'da' - in a 'da' wiki. ) AssetDenmark (talk) 15:29, 11 April 2019 (UTC) (actually the time here was 17:29??)

AssetDenmark, Help talk:Extension:Translate is the best place for your questions. You will have more people there replying. Trizek (WMF) (talk) 16:26, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

Trizek (WMF) - thanks, I already "added my problem/ide" to the original post import 200 pages as translated. AssetDenmark (talk) 17:56, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

(way back in time I made the | googletranslate "extension", is now outdated. It did what I needed, but I appriciate that the Language bundle adds much more value. AssetDenmark (talk) 18:04, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

Wikipedia

Can it be used in Wikipedia ? BoldLuis (talk) 05:18, 9 March 2021 (UTC)

@BoldLuis: No. This extension’s purpose is translating content within one wiki, not across wikis like Wikipediæ. —Tacsipacsi (talk) 01:35, 10 March 2021 (UTC)

Ah, Ok. I put the suggestion it can be used to translate Wikipediae. BoldLuis (talk) 18:45, 11 March 2021 (UTC)

Please don’t, this extension is simply not suitable for article translation by design. It gives very little room for divergence (e.g. to highlight things of local importance), requires quite some preparation work per page, which is acceptable if we need a system that facilitates efficient non-diverging translation and keeping translations in sync, but it’s way too much work for a one-off translation, and so on. —Tacsipacsi (talk) 23:17, 11 March 2021 (UTC)

Should mention more about segmentation?

I just recieved the following comment on my talk page at Meta:

Hi, Pppery! Thanks for enabling translation for Web2Cit/Early adopters. I saw your comment in your edition's summary and I apologize I hadn't completed all the preparation tasks I was expected to. Actually, I just followed the steps here, where it just says that I have to wrap the whole content between <translate></translate>. I didn't know I had to split the content into translate chunks, or that I had to wrap variables. Maybe the tutorial should be updated to better reflect this? What do you think? Thanks again! Diegodlh (talk) 03:24, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

Reposted here by * Pppery * _{it has begun} 03:29, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

Why won't the text on some pages show up for the translation?

This is the page that I need to translate from Russian to Ukrainian and even after I marked the page for translation I still can't see the translation units. The list is empty.

<translate> <!--T:5--> '''''Boolean''''' - логический тип данных, который представляет значения ''True'' (''истина'') и ''False'' (''ложь''). Под ''истиной'' в ''VPA'' подразумевается любое отличное от нуля значение, а под ''ложью'' - значение ''0''.<br /> Пример: ''B := True''; ''B := False''; ''B := a > b''; // если a > b, то B = True, если a < b, то B = False [[Категория:Типы данных VPA]] </translate>

For some pages it works, for the others it does not. Why? MrJConstantine (talk) 07:31, 22 September 2022 (UTC)

Empty translation unit for marker, and similar errors

It's easy to accidentally delete or misplace one of the markers, especially in visual editor. I don't particularly care about modularity and consistency at the moment - is it possible to just use one marker for the entire page? ProfaneServitor (talk) 05:35, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

If you don’t care about modularity and consistency, then don’t use the extension – having a single “translation unit” per page provides no better translator experience than having to translate the page manually. —Tacsipacsi (talk) 10:51, 21 December 2022 (UTC)

I still like having separate pages for different translations without having to link them manually. ProfaneServitor (talk) 02:09, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

You can do that with a template like {{Languages }}. —Tacsipacsi (talk) 19:31, 22 December 2022 (UTC)